This is a machine translation of the first part of a 2003 Portal Credo interview with Bp. Gregory Grabbe's daughter. The part in red below indicates that St. Philaret was against the western rite experiment in France.
February 18, 2003
INTERVIEW: "With the saints to live - do not let my God." On the history and personalities of the ROCOR - AG Shatilova, daughter of Bishop Gregory Grabbe
Anastasia G. Shatilova - a living witness of the history of the Russian Orthodox Church Abroad. Her father - Archpriest George Grabbe - was an associate of Metropolitan Anthony (Khrapovitski), the first primate of the ROCOR. For many years he was first in protoiereyskom and then a bishop - as Bishop Gregory - was secretary of the Holy Synod of ROCOR. Our correspondent talked to the AG Shatilova, who told many interesting stories that shed light on the history of the Russian Orthodox emigration, relations with the Orthodox Church Moscow Patriarchate and other churches.
On the first years of the ROCOR and the "glorification of Hitler"
Portal-Credo.Ru: Tell us about the activities of the Church Abroad in Serbia and Belgrade.
Anastasia Bonner: Metropolitan Anthony of Karlovci lived in the Patriarchate. He was given three rooms. One of them, the huge, and was the dining room and reception area. Another was in secret, the third - the bedroom. To him often visited Patriarch Barnabas, who loved and respected the Metropolitan, was his student. But, unfortunately, many MPs' blood spoiled "is not so much the Metropolitan, as my father. They always put pressure on Patriarch then, that he has neutralized the Metropolitan. Pope had sometimes very serious talk with the Patriarch that they are giving us autonomy greatly interfere in our internal affairs. Serge strongly sought to have not considered with Metropolitan Anthony. When the synod moved to Belgrade, the era of the Metropolitan Anastasia. There was already a little easier. Despite the fact that Metropolitan Anastasius too was very high, he did not have the enormous weight against the whole universal Church, which was at the Metropolitan Anthony. Therefore, in our case is less interfered. But the Patriarch was incredibly attentive to the Lord Antony. And when the Lord died, the patriarch immediately came to him in Belgrade and was there until his death. The funeral service was performed in the Serbian Cathedral, attended by about a hundred priests.
- And on what did he die?
- For a gastric illness, did not know what it represents. But it was quite patristic death. He died in full consciousness. The Patriarch asked him whether he fears death. Replied: "None." And his last words were: "Thank you, Fyodor, for everything." Fyodor had his cell-attendant.
- Probable, then it was believed that in Russia these "riots" not for long, and soon all be over?
- Of course, nobody thought that this revolution can keep their power and eighty years. After the Soviet Union officially recognized only in the 39th year. Prior to that, even the Serbian government did not recognize him.
- Do you remember any talk of Russia in the 30s?
- Of course, we all watched the events. At the Synod of up to 37-year bond was one kegebistom. However, systematic connection, of course, was not. Still, it was a closed country. Something learned in Romania, something in Bulgaria ...
- Tell me a story about supposedly laudatory letter to Hitler.
- I'll tell you what it was. Bishop Tikhon of Berlin bought a building that would be as flat and at the same time, have a church there. The plan was very good, but required a rework of the building and, of course, financial costs, of which he was not. This building became interested in the Ministry of Labour and decided to buy it. At that time, Stalin denounced churches, but Hitler did not want to make it known that he used the church building. Then the government proposed that they will land in Berlin, where the temple would be built partly on the resources of the diocese and in part by Government funds. This temple is very big and majestic stands in a very beautiful place in Berlin. This is the first Russian church in the capital in the history of Germany. What remained for the Synod to do this? The consecration of the temple was so grand that some of the patriarchs have sent delegates, and those who are unable to attend, sent greetings to the Synod. It was a common Orthodox event! Metropolitan came to the consecration. A small Russian colony, who was there, Hitler had already prepared an address where it was painted and painted. Metropolitan read it and was unhappy. But the problem was that the text of this address colony already sent by ministries and government agencies. Something to change was impossible. So Metropolitan is simply placed before the fact.
- Now this address, and charged with the Church Abroad, which she supported Hitler.
- Yes, but this story was so ridiculous that the church life of this address was never published. I wanted to see him at least and so wrote to Berlin two people who I know were related to the office, asking me to get this same address. They told me that they do not. Of course, this address was too "flowery" form, but not to thank you for this gift, it would be improper.
- Especially because he was perceived by the entire Orthodox world at the time. Synod received a lot of congratulations, greetings.
- And how to further develop the event began when the Germans had already began to suffer defeat?
- Even with Metropolitan Seraphim of Berlin, which, incidentally, also criticized the Germans demanded that he would not let so-called "ostarbaytov" (working from the east) to the church. He said: "I have to call people to church, and not to drive. But if you want to put their picket lines - please place. But I deny nothing will." And so the Germans did nothing. But then this temple was quickly captured by the Moscow Patriarchate.
- I wanted to ask you more about the sects of Plato and Eulogy.
- It was also planned, because Plato, on the one hand, it wanted to achieve autocephalous, but on the other hand, all the while deceiving Cathedral. He said that he needed to deal with the laity, which in America is very independent, but really, it just "hammered" autocephalous. Eulogy fell immediately into the hands of the Masons. In fact, this one most evlogiansky Theological Institute - is to create a Eulogy. Metropolitan Anthony is very upset because it was his soul mate Eulogy and even student. They were friends. In the beginning, in the 35th year when it arranged the meeting, Eulogy has signed the document, but, on arrival in Paris forced him to abandon the Masons. All this was aimed at something to win over Orthodox Church Outside of two major parts. The formal reason for refusal was the fact that their report at the Council removed the item from the second to the third or fourth. That is such an occasion was found to leave and slam the door.
The bishops of the ROCOR, anathema to ecumenism, and the life of the Church Abroad
- And His Eminence was here, in Russia?
- No, he did not go to Russia. It was a different story. His whole family was in the ROC for decades.
- In what country?
- In Canada. He was the first who was in the Orthodox Church. Hilarion filed a petition to the Academy of St. Petersburg or Moscow, I do not remember. He was admitted, could only find a place where he will live. But when he arrived, told him to go in Jordanville in seminary. But, as you seem to have little difference between the Academy and Seminary?
- I do not know, I think that in Jordanville, perhaps better taught in the seminary.
- Even when Metropolitan Filaret has been talk that the government will close the seminary, because even a high enough level to college.
While studying at the seminary, he became Bishop Averky cell attendant, who "gave" two languages at once - it's too much, he said. And, since he was a member of the Synod, he has always lay all the protocols of the paper. My father had already started complaining that somewhere is leaking information. Unfortunately, could not determine where. Most likely it was from the Hilarion, because then he made a sack and an archive, and archive in the synodal he worked serving MP. What it can be expected?
- And could you elaborate how to make an anathema to ecumenism?
- Of course, it was discussed at the council, but in the minutes of the discussion there. This anathema has been drafted in Boston monastery, translated the Lord Alipov, then Chicago. But, since he knew enough English, I had to adjust its translation into Slavic. Then, at the councils did not use tape as it is now, and three or four bishops made their records each. And then the lord of this Gregory was one protocol, and then I typed it. In this case, perhaps on purpose, no record of ecumenism was not. Secretaries were then Archbishop Paul, Hilarion, and Mark. And most importantly - my father. It is possible that they simply did not give him the text. Because of their records I had not seen. And yet, so it was all officially, in 1997, they referred to the same ruling council of ecumenism.
- Of course. Their signatures were under anathema?
- Yes, of course there were.
- And how to Metropolitan Filaret himself belonged to the heterodox and ecumenism?
- For non-Orthodox, he is very well regarded. As a human being is very good. It is not necessarily to treat them badly!
- Of course, I think so too. Still, Metropolitan Filaret was able to insist on his own.
- Of course. But with all these riots, which were both before and during his reign, he complained that he had nothing to do with bishops there. He has repeatedly said that he alone is to retire.
- Why did he not go? He still knew that then it will be a different course?
- I think so. They had different views.
- In what sense?
- Even on the question of ecumenism. Anthony of Geneva was a strong ecumenical, at what could be a big boor. He wrote several letters to Metropolitan rather boorish!
- How to react to this metropolitan?
- Very serious. My father tried to calm and reconcile both sides, because Anthony of Geneva was still second only to the Metropolitan by seniority.
- Maybe it would be better to use harsh measures against the ecumenists?
- By ecumenists, in the end, the measures taken. Ecumenism declared heresy, and anathematized. But Anthony of Geneva did not immediately agree. It is, generally, very byliz left the family. Even on the question of the canonization of the royal family the very first protest. Then agreed, but with the proviso that it had been in last place. A papagovoril: "Nothing! If only we put them in last place, and the Russian people to put on first!" And so it happened.
- And on the list are in last place?
- ... "The last shall be first" ... And when the Metropolitan has to be firm?
-“The last shall be first” … and when the Metropolitan also displayed firmness?
- For example, when John of Shanghai received the Dutch and gave them the possibility to serve the western Paschalion. It was a very difficult moment and didn’t last a long time. The Council (of Bishops, transl.) insisted that John of Shanghai demanded from them the old style (calendar, transl.). They left right away to the MP. The second case was when either by fault or mistake of Vladika John, Nectari (Kovalevskii) was consecrated. He ordained him with Theofil - the Rumanian, who, by the way, was in the Church Abroad, but later was discovered that he was a drug addict. The Sovereign said, that “(to be) Rumanian (is not to be) a nation, but an occupation”. The Synod had received the warning that, according to one version, Kovalevskii was a Satanist, and according to other, a big mason. It can be said that his aspect was such, that there is a possibility, he was a Satanist. (What a) sinister appearance! Nonetheless, his consecration was done against the resolution of the Council (of Bishops, transl.). Metropolitan Filaret was so against all this business, that he didn’t take part on it at all. Whenever he traveled to France, he never served there. Overall, these Frenchmen left rather quickly. By the way, also upon recommendation of Vladika John, they also wanted to recreate the Gallican Liturgy. An infinite number of translations were distributed to all the hierarchs. But right at the time of the liturgy it seems to be there was not a sufficient …
- Eucharistic canon?
- And was it cancelled?
- It should have been, but all this business didn’t last more than 2-3 years.
- And Vladika Filaret didn’t approve the idea of the Gallican Liturgy?
- No. But it was not easy for him to resist 15 hierarchs. Not all of them had such an educational level that was possible to take into consideration what they said.
- Have you worked in the archives of the Synod of ...
- Yes, but in no nightmare to anticipate what happened next, we could not. Gregory took the only Lord of the correspondence with the bishops more or less prominent public figures - and all.
- And now, much is lost?
- I think almost everything. For example, from Archbishop Gabriel I just found out that we have kept the originals of the protocols in '21.
- They also lost?
- They do not get lost! They were stolen. Hilarion was to let employees work in the archives of the MP. We had such a system: the keys to the archives were at Lord Gregory, and I still have a priest. Three key just happened. If any bishop or metropolitan of the same like any business to see it brought him a receipt. In our time, to steal something that was impossible! But then later I witnessed egregious cases. I needed a document with a speech by Bishop Gregory of consecration as a bishop. I asked the Bishop Hilarion to order me to give this document. Near a tipchik in cassock and turns suddenly intervenes in our conversation: "I'll get". And ran. I asked him: "O Lord! Who is this guy?" "Oh, you know, like we owe! He works in the archives of the Moscow Patriarchy! He gave us so many documents" - went on to explain Hilarion. I say: "Lord, what do you do? ..." - "In the Synod have no secrets."
- And so they plundered the entire archive. In addition, they have designated an employee of a type that has just finished Highscool, a dropout. And, since kindergarten he could handle a computer, it became the entire archive to the computer to translate. I was told that he was more than half of the archive, then, that thought it unnecessary, simply threw away. Two mother told me that the street had two baskets in the archives. I detract them to give me, but they were afraid. Then it all just disappeared ... At one time I formed a book store, which was considered the best on the coast. I had 400 Russian titles and approximately 300 U.S.. And when reporters went to the Soviet Union, they came up to me to buy books and consult, what to read before they enter the Soviet Union. This store is also virtually destroyed. They began selling wooden spoons and stuff like that. In one of my visits, I decided to go to the store to buy tapes, CDs as gifts - we have still very good chorus was. Has not met a single soul in the synod! But I still knew all the ins outs, I see a door ajar. Gone. About 20 minutes walking around the Synod, on three floors and has not met a single person! Archive has been opened, there were books, and if I wanted to, could easily take any of them and leave. When I was about to leave, suddenly a telephone operator in the street with a cup of coffee and sandwiches. I explained to her that I had to get into the book store. The telephone then began to cry the whole synod of some of Andrew. Finally he appeared. It turned out that he was janitor. He had a key with which he opened a warehouse and left. I began to see what they have. Not a single book price was not. I wrote down on paper what had taken. Went back, long and loud call Andrew. Of any "earth" to get it. He closed, and I happily retired and not having an account.
- They may be given to you for many years of work there? But, of course, terrible state in which there is everything!
- Yes, there because everything is open! For example, I knew the code safe. They kept robe Kursk icon. When Bishop Theophanes the left of the Kursk, he took with him two: one for the cheapest garment, that is the most famous, blue enamel, and another gold with precious stones. She always was in the safe. In addition, there have always been jewels, which were given to decorations for the miraculous icon. Bands were kept there for someone of Optina elders. Paraman Metropolitan Anastasia was there.
- Yes, wishing they could find ...
- I am afraid that this is all they played.
ROCOR and the Catacomb Church in Russia
- What do you know about the connection with Metropolitan Filaret catacombniks?
- Main communication occurred through Stephen Krasovitskaia. Then contacted by Archimandrite Lazarus and C14 th clergy. It was decided to ordain anyone to the episcopate. They were not headed, as their bishop died. Barnabas was ordained, but with the proviso that it will never be known. Just to make it ordained Lazarus. I would like to attend the consecration of this, because I know that as a priest he knows very little, especially consecration. All communications were then incredibly secret. My father was afraid to give someone, probably with good reason. Therefore, when there were letters from Russia, I typed them on the Synod's typewriter. And then they showed at the meeting of the bishops synod. And even typewritten we reprinted that it was impossible to trace the author. Gradually, relations grew. Often the letters were transported via diplomatic channels.
- But there were two candidates: o.Mihail (Christmas) and o.Gury?
- The information we have failed. We learned about this postfactum.
- I heard that the Lord did not trust catacombniks Lazarus.
- Yes. Lazarus on the issue with catacombniks very guilty. One man gave my father a list of 12 bishops of the Catacomb addresses. Unfortunately, instead of having to give me a copy, he handed them over to the Metropolitan. Lists bore the meeting of the Synod. My father thought that it is necessary to use max oikonomia, in order to unite them all. Lazar said that they were all totally illegal, except him alone.
- Yes, very sad. I heard that Archbishop Anthony of Geneva organized ordination. And that he put forth Lazarus, instead of those who wanted catacombniks.
- Probably. Resolution of the Otomi, to make this consecration was, but my father was very afraid that they can "let out" our bishops. It was therefore decided that the synod will simply reported that it is done.
- But, because in the end, Lazarus ordained. Dimitri A. (Dudko) knew it.
- Dudko had nothing to do with catacombniks. Metropolitan Filaret wrote him a letter is not an incentive!
- However, he once took part in the ordination of Bishop Lazarus.
- That I do not know. In general, we have ties with Russia until the 37th year has been pretty thorough. There was a group (in particular, prof. Andrew was in it), which went specially to Sergius to Stragorodsky beg on their knees to give up the declaration. And when the prof. St. Andrew's went abroad, he was struck by how much I knew at the Synod of the episcopate in Russia. Until the 37th, was a kegebist who filed the data on all of those killed, tortured, exiled, etc. Then, perhaps, he was caught, because the connection was interrupted. Recovered she was in 40th years, when many were fleeing from the Germans.
- As the election was held Metropolitan Anastasia?
- During the life of Metropolitan Anthony made his authorized deputy. Metropolitan Anthony was already difficult to manage, it was in poor health, and the Metropolitan Anastasius was already so well-known bishop, that at the council, despite his youth, received seventy votes. The whole ceremony was the enthronement of Patriarch compiled them, and also religious celebrations for the 300th anniversary of the Romanov dynasty, the 100th anniversary of the Battle of Borodino was drawn to them. In Moscow, he was a prominent church and social activist. So for all, without a doubt, it was clear that only Anastasios and may be the next Metropolitan. But he was very modest - when Metropolitan Anthony insisted to give him a white hood, Anastasius refused for over a year. Then the Patriarch Barnabas Metropolitan complained to it. The Patriarch invited the entire synod to dinner, then got up from the table, took off his white hood and put on the back of the head of the Metropolitan. And only after that he started wearing a white hood. That is such a funny, but typical of the Metropolitan Anastasia case. He was surprisingly modest. Come to the dentist and sat in the audience and waited for their turn, until someone realized that here sits Metropolitan Anastasius.
- And then it passed out of turn?
- Well, of course. He was already then Primate.
- A place where worship, connected with his election as Primate?
- In Belgrade, but I was not on it.
- And where you found the war began?
- It so happened that he was not just metropolitan "cut off" because he went to Switzerland at the moment when the war broke out. Literally, the last train through Italy he was in Yugoslavia. When it all ended in failure, was a very funny situation. The Bolsheviks declared that no Synod was no more, nobody knows where Metropolitan ... It links with other countries did not have any, all borders were closed. And so, my uncle (cousin moeybabushki) o.Iov Leontiev, a direct descendant of Kutuzov, the officer Hussars and served French, Metropolitan and played such a combination: o.Iov was presented to patients, accompanied by his "lay brother" Metropolitan Anastasius, which no travel documents. Then all the officials could not grasp why all the fuss about some little old man, who is relatively young, the sick and important. And so he was able to get out of Germany, and the entire free world knew that there Synod and Metropolitan. Before the war, Metropolitan was in Switzerland on church matters. And when the war ended, he was in Germany, which was divided into four parts: the French, Soviet, British and American. It was very difficult to get from one area to another, for it required a very large documents. The Soviet Union gave the whole protest, when the Metropolitan came to Switzerland. Moscow insisted that he was expelled from the country. Held a special meeting of the Swiss government on this issue! But then, oddly, has interfered American Metropolis, and that it failed to stop. The late Metropolitan Theophilus of America wrote these papers, which could impact on Switzerland.
- And how you traveled from Serbia to Germany?
- Metropolitan Anastasius was always too cautious, and sometimes acted on his nerves. Everyone was clear that everything is in failure, and Metropolitan has not wanted to leave. The Pope agreed with the Germans that they will train for the Synod, and Metropolitan and place does not think to move. In the end it turned out that his father literally pushed his knee on the stairs of the Metropolitan train so that he somehow latched on the last train. We were sent to grammar school, and had no idea where my father and left a Metropolitan? That was such a period.
St. John of Shanghai and the Synod of the ROCA
- And could you tell more detail about the riot in San Francisco?
- This riot was so hot that there were suicides.
- Because of what he started?
- In the words of Archbishop Anastasios, "When starting to build a new church
- there are always thousands of temptations." In San Francisco they had the old cathedral, which was very small. We decided to build a new one. We bought a plot - it was formerly the city dump. The first split occurred for this reason: "How can you build a church in the city dump?" The debate began to grow and the parish council. In America, the Parish Council is the owner of the property to interfere in these affairs at the bishops are very limited. As a result, the council split. That was when the Lord ... The mayor Tikhon Khrapov was a construction company. He then began construction. It was later revealed that he robbed the receipts of several hundred thousand dollars. All this resulted in control over the bishops of the Laity and poured into a form that the decision of the cathedral, the Synod is invalid if it has not been approved by the laity. Assigned there Archbishop Anthony of Los Angeles to investigate the case. It caused great resentment. Right group was happy that at least something after all is done, the left - a scandal. This always happens: someone is offended, someone happy, someone ambition "leaped" - religious matters they are not interested. The Devil knows how to work well. Took advantage of the Bolsheviks, who were all playing. Metropolitan realized that he was unable to cope with this case and sent my father there to investigate. Lord John stood on the side of the crooks, and unfortunately this has an aggressive stance: "The Synod has no right to control - the case of the diocese. Diocese is independent of the Synod." It was known that to be very scandalous meeting of the Parish Council. For this reason, he was ordered to postpone the meeting. But he did not read the decree, broke it and said "he does not care about regulations synods and councils." When the bishop says that he has the highest church authorities there, then you will agree, this is something wrong? .. The case went through the civil court, where they stated that there is no synod or council, which can control this diocese. Ie denied higher church administration. My dad had to testify in court that it violates the whole hierarchy of the Church. Metropolitan Anastasius, was then already in a state that morning, took a decision in the evening - another. My father had great difficulty trying to somehow preserve the authority of the Synod. After that, the newspapers wrote that "Grabbe writes" Aesopian "language." told his father: "Enough! resigns, take-coming ..." .- "On the Cross removed from him, do not go" - he replied.
- If he threw the Church would have been worse ... you tell us about the canonization of the martyrs.
- We had a great excitement about how not to fall into martyrs sergiantsy. All martyrs, tortured and 27 of the year, the issue did not constitute. Further were assigned to Jordanville. They were supposed to send the materials, and they develop them. I suspect that they have nothing to do but, nevertheless, has compiled a list of 8 thousand names that will be compiled canonization. Drafting Service Royal New Martyrs Anthony Sandzhulovskomu instructed. It is composed of very competent, but not in a perjury troparion not specified. Despite the fact that my father noticed it, the service approved. Service of all the Russian New Martyrs was Archbishop Anthony of San Francisco. It was very chaotic! During the liturgy, I was running with different amendments to the choir - it changed everything, even during the service!
- But service is approved in advance?
- Of course. Metropolitan Anthony was a very good, but incredibly chaotic! I was his consecration as bishop, which he lost his mantle. And he was always so, I remember it even priest. Incredibly good, very pious, but ... very emotional.
- Anastasia Bonner, please say a few words of Metropolitan Anthony.
- The Metropolitan Anthony was absolutely wonderful trait - he could talk to anyone at any level! Will it be the rural illiterate grandmother, or a small child, or a professor - no one felt that he was somehow looking down on them.
- I know that he loved young people.
- Very loved. The bishops then received a rather big salary, and it contains all the poor students. In fact, he only painted what he receives a salary. When he got to the Pochaev Lavra, was not a single spare room - the students came from all over Russia! We slept side by side and just on the floor because some cells did not suffice. Still, he led three spiritual academy. Students loved it and went around him, where they could. Before he was rector of the Academy - A Difficult personality. A Metropolitan immediately began to use these students, even from a practical point of view. Everyone had or garden, or garden. And the fact is the economy of the Rector?! .. Here it is these students and enjoyed. They always came to him in the evening to drink tea. There have been serious conversations, and sometimes just joking. He had a favorite anecdote: "I love the purity!" - Said the old woman, overturning a nightgown on the "new year".
- Yes, I heard he was a very cheerful person.
- Very. Therefore, after such a joke, the students already talked with him more freely. Metropolitan is an incredibly high raised monk! After all, there was a time when almost no one tonsured.
- This is even before the revolution?
- Yes. And when the Lord Antonia many students became monks.
Saint John of Shanghai Miracle
- Yes. And why so many did not like St. John of Shanghai?
- A friend of my father wrote: "With the saints to live - do not let my God. With the saints give rest - wonderful!" He entire way at Lesna Convent overturned. For example, for its existence, they are a factory in a row have to sew dolls. Lord will take and arrange a lecture, and the contract doll that should be on time! All the time he changed his plans. He was not an administrator, and have been complaints that he never signed any of it do not get one, it is unclear what happens to the money, that somewhere he lost them. Of course, this is not any crime, just to work with him was very difficult. And when he left France, they happily breathed. Of course, it was prayer, and ascetic, and unconditional seer - no doubts there!
- It was the same as one of the ancient saints.
- Yes. Once he dined with us. At the dinner was a trout. I put him on a plate of whole fish. Can you imagine that he ate it all, even with gills! None of the seeds did not leave!
- He ate out of humility. He's all mixed in one bowl, remembers Father Georges (Larin). When he was young, I saw how the Lord has mixed all - pudding, soup, and the second - and ate it.
- Away he did not, but it struck us the other behavior. He basically walked only in sandals. After being shorn, he did not put on shoes. There was such a case, when he came out with an airplane, it flew open robe, and beneath it there is nothing. In Paris, he regularly served as the funeral of the area in which the murdered King Alexander.
- Yes, all too shy to serve with him, only he was persistent.
- Imagine a funeral in Red Square ...
- I would love to!
- ... And when the cars go. After King Alexander was killed when he rode with the royal cortege. And so, John of Shanghai was a memorial service every year on the road. He was an original.
- And what you remember about him?
- There was a funny story with us. He was visiting his parents. My sister was eight years old, and sent us to bed at eight o'clock in the evening without reservation - the sun is shining or not. And when everyone left, my sister ran out, embraced him and kissed him, and Lord laughed and said, "Well, the first female kiss!"
- It has been in Belgrade?
- Yes. In my opinion, he has not finished medical education. Then he switched to theology. Students it is always poor, so he ran through the streets, selling newspapers. Never admit that somewhere on the sidewalk lay the bread is always raised and ate it. Because this is a great sin, throw the bread.
- Is it possible to see bread on the sidewalk in the years since it was a difficult time?
- Yugoslavia was the richest country until the Communists took her no. There was not a mineral, which is not found in Yugoslavia.
- A good attitude to the Russian?
- Yes, but we lived as a state within a state. For example, I spoke in Serbian is very bad, and we were taught in Serbian language school on the same level as French or German. The only thing we had yet to learn the Serbian history and geography to some extent, because if you live in this country, it is necessary to know. And the rest, we lived as a state within a state, we had our male and female high school, primary school, clinic. A great big house was called "The House of Czar Nicholas," donated his king Alexander.
Olga Mitrenina for "Portal-Credo.ru"